LAZAR
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**A:** Yeah. It was a cashier’s check.
**MF:** Okay. What was — what was the nature of your relationship? Was it that friendly kind of man on man talk about gear and jets and stuff like that?
**A:** Yeah. Yeah. That’s about the size of it. Yeah.
**MF:** And, did you find him — as far as his knowledge of what you spoke about to be credible?
**A:** Yeah. You know, Bob’s not a stupid person. He’s — he’s very intelligent. He’s also very clever and kind of a little bit of a con man, I guess you’d say. He’s always got something going, but he is very intelligent.
**MF:** Did he ever — I mean was there any — any circumstances or anything that he ever told you up to a point before he — he got money from you that led you to believe that he was — well, not on the level with you?
**A:** Right after I loaned him the money, he had also — him and Carol, his ex — his wife, had claimed that they had bought a bordello in Nevada, okay, and that they were operating this bordello going back and forth, had a madam running it for them, and they would sell T-shirts and things with the bordello’s name here in the — in the shop in Los Alamos. And, I did a little checking on that, and I found out that there was no business registered under that name. And so, that’s when I started to figure out a lot of the things he was telling me, at least about his personal life and business dealings, was untrue, but technically, he seemed to be fairly sharp.
**MF:** Did he ever talk about UFOs with you?
**A:** No, he didn’t.
**MF:** Okay, so that — that was never part of the — the — the talks. Did he ever talk about exotic technologies or …
**A:** Oh, yeah.
**MF:** Okay.
**A:** Quite a bit.
**MF:** Would they be like talking, like I read this interesting story on this, or did you see on TV, or were they things that he had worked with? Did you …
**A:** He — it was always seemed to be something he claimed he had worked with or invented or done.
**MF:** But — but, was there ever any — was there any hardware
to back it up?
**A:** No, not really. He was always building little electronics gadgets and things like that. Naturally he built the jet. He was a relatively good welder, so as far as I said — as far as technical stuff goes, he — he could back that up.
**MF:** That certainly seems to go with what I [indisc.] I’ve heard about him about being technically minded and at least in a hardware sense being adept.
**A:** Yeah. I would — I would certainly consider him to be more of a technician than a physicist.
**MF:** Okay. So, you — there was never — what — what is your background, as much as you would like to tell me as far as what you do and your schooling.
**A:** I’m — I’m a technician. I’ve had a few years of college, and I’m journeyman machinist by trade.
**MF:** Okay. What was the amount of money that he borrowed from you for the car?
**A:** $2,000 as I recall.
**MF:** Okay.
**A:** And, he was supposed to pay me $500 in interest.
**MF:** And, the entire $2,500 was paid?
**A:** Yes.
**MF:** But, how many years late?
**A:** Oh, five.
**MF:** Okay.
**A:** You know there was actually — I told him, you know, I wasn’t able to give him that money for very long, and we had set up a deal that if — if he was late, he would pay a substantial penalty in interest of ten percent for every six months it was late. And, that was never paid. It was just the straight $500. But, I was glad to get that back.
**MF:** Was there any contact after he left Los Alamos with
you?
**A:** None whatsoever.
**MF:** Okay. So, he just — he up and left and that was it?
**A:** Yeah. Oh, wait a minute. I did get a hold of him. I tracked him down, and I did get a hold of him by phone. And, I reminded him that he owed me money, and he — he said okay, basically check’s in the mail, and never heard from him again. He changed his phone number and — and things like that, so …
**MF:** And, this is when he moved to Las Vegas from Los Alamos then?
**A:** Yeah, and he had declared bankruptcy. He skipped out on all his debts in town. He owed probably about $60,000 to Los Alamos National Bank for the photo processing equipment. He just skipped out on that.
**MF:** So, it was a matter of here one day and gone another?
**A:** Yeah. He was gone within — I mean it was overnight.
**MF:** Did your — the nature of your relationship change once you gave him money?
**A:** No. Not really.
**MF**: You — you still hung out together, talked about gear and stuff like that?
**A:** Yeah.
**MF:** How old are you, sir?
**A:** Thirty-three.
**MF:** Okay. So you’re — I’m — I’m thirty-three, too, so — so you’re — roughly let’s see, Lazar is in his late thirties now, I guess.
**A:** Yeah.
**MF:** So, what was the circumstances on which you met? Was it in any professional capacity with the lab or anything like that or just happened to meet up? Is Los Alamos a small town?